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4 May 2018
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Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: Honduras
Posts: 175
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tremens
they not really lost you, you bought technically a KTM 
but I agree, they recently started to introduce new bikes very slowly and way too early before they can actually sell it. I guess they envy Africa Twin success with that strategy. But some are not too patient and lose interest.
Let see, 1 year or more prototyping and teasing, then 1 year to make it available plus another year or so to fix all the issues. Again new AT is perfect example. People don't have time today for this games. |
I read an article recently that discussed the Honda AT in relation to the other 1000cc+ ADV bikes on the market. The author's argument was that the AT was never meant to battle the big KTM 1090/1190 nor the 1200GS. Those are $20,000 bikes. It was built and marketed with the intention of grabbing sales from the few middlewights (Tiger 800, BMW 800/850, etc) that offered similar figures on paper, this being weight, power output and price point. They also had the name Africa Twin which they very cleverly leveraged. KTM guys will buy the big KTMs. BMW guys will buy the big BMWs. For the rest of the market, they had a product that was priced similarly to smaller displacement bikes like the Tiger and offered a historically significant bike that is considered by many a very strong world tourer. Plus they have their Honda name.
It would seem that the ideal middleweight ADV bike is a bit of a unicorn and as a result, rumors of a lightweight yet powerful 700/800cc bike from big names like KTM and Yamaha will excite the masses. It's an untouched segment right now save for BMW's middleweight line and Triumph's bike, which have become more and more bloated over the years.
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5 May 2018
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Join Date: Aug 2015
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ThirtyOne
It would seem that the ideal middleweight ADV bike is a bit of a unicorn and as a result, rumors of a lightweight yet powerful 700/800cc bike from big names like KTM and Yamaha will excite the masses. It's an untouched segment right now save for BMW's middleweight line and Triumph's bike, which have become more and more bloated over the years.
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yeah, and I am surprised BMW came up with F850GS and abandoned F650GS.
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5 May 2018
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Join Date: Mar 2014
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tremens
yeah, and I am surprised BMW came up with F850GS and abandoned F650GS.
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This forum is filled, mostly, with travelers who want reliable economical lightweight bikes. I think that most of these companies cater more to the short term, weekend, riders that want higher power figures and comfort. I would venture to say that 70hp is probably a baseline number that many would want from a middleweight bike and to make an engine that produces that much power and also be long term reliable from a manufacturers perspective, they need larger displacements and therefore more weight. Yes, you can get 70 hp out of a smaller engine, but it's going to be working harder and longevity is probably one of the primary concerns for a manufacturer.
Also, why did they drop the 650? I guess it wasn't selling enough. Manufacturers respond to market demands that are in their economic interest. They're in the business of making money. A small group of overlanders and some longer weekend warriors does not give them enough reason to make a bike catered to us.
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4 Jun 2018
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Location: Tartu, Estonia
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Wasn't the F650/F700 the same engine as the F800, just in a different state of tune, for marketing purposes? I guess the F700 was not sufficiently cheaper, and they just decided to market the higher number.
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4 Jun 2018
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There is a new F750GS alongside the 850 and replacing the old 650/700.
Same differences: cast TL wheels (19” front) lower tune as you say, lower saddle and much cheaper. I thought the 650 made a great travel bike. Same price diff with the new ones: 850 from £9,400, 750 = £7,950.
One reason the F650Gs became a ‘700’ in 2012 was to belatedly deconfuse it from the 650 single.
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8 Jun 2018
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Weight with 17lt fuel 165kg, well proven 600cc engine, seat height 920mm Off road orientated suspension, no unnecessary electrics, reasonably priced, just need to add luggage and ride, sound good specs. Think AJP pr7.
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8 Jun 2018
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Have you ridden the AJP? Own one? If so, what can you tell us about it?
We've heard about this bike for a few years at least, guess one can now buy it in UK/EU. BTW, HOW MUCH? $$$$ ??
Haven't read any detailed ride reports on this bike ... do you have any good links?
I'm curious who designed the engine and where said engine is actually manufactured. Any clue on this? I hope it's a good one ... it will need to be.
My 40 HP Suzuki DR650se (a 21 year old design without revision) is 365 lbs. wet weight. I own a 2006, it's done over 60K miles now. Not one problem.
When riders start circling the globe on the AJP then I would give it a very close look. 
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8 Jun 2018
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Actually it is out or so it says here
AJP PR 7 Rally 600cc
@10k
Oh, hold on - it says "Make a down payment of $500.00 below…."
Looks like it uses the old Husky TE 610 motor like the upcoming CCMs and the SWMs.
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8 Jun 2018
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Great! 
I wonder if it's produced at the Noale, Italy factory (near Lake Como) where old Huskies and MV's were produced?
I think MV may still be produced there? Good engines for the most part.
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9 Jun 2018
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Location: Mimbres, New Mexico, USA
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris Scott
Actually it is out or so it says here
AJP PR 7 Rally 600cc
@10k
Oh, hold on - it says "Make a down payment of $500.00 below…."
Looks like it uses the old Husky TE 610 motor like the upcoming CCMs and the SWMs. |
I went to Overland Expo in Flagstaff Arizona a few weeks ago, and there was a PR7 in a vendors booth there. They were selling luggage, I think, and had the bike to show their setup. I wasn't
interseted in buying one, so didn't take any notes or anything, but it looks like a top tier bike, and they do exist here in the states.
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9 Jun 2018
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mollydog
When riders start circling the globe on the AJP then I would give it a very close look. |
https://www.facebook.com/Wired4adventure/ 
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9 Jun 2018
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Don't own a PR7 but have owned a PR4 for 2 years, and reading blog was interested to find out why the PR7 was not in contention, despite it seeming to fit the discussion? After many Hondas going from SL's(not sure if anyone remembers this designation!) XL, XR, and CRF the AJP was a gamble as I wanted to end my days on a CRF 230 after a dalliance with Kawasaki and GAS GAS. But comparing the 2 the PR4 was it's equal, but had real suspension and all the good gear and no mods necessary just fuel up and ride, Mr Pinto over in Portugal seems to know what he is doing (these are not Chinese bikes and are a long way from those). To be honest have become quite a fan of the make hence my blog, also have another ADV bike (A Scrambler don't laugh suits me as a tourer and has taken me on many low key dirt outback and High country rides) and PR7 is a bit too dirt oriented at this stage. The PR7 like all AJP'S seems to sit in the middle and hopefully the Yamaha won't end up a porker and KTM being their over exuberant selves put out another racer. Hope I didn't bore anyone.
Joe P.S I think the RE Himalaya is pretty cool too!
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9 Jul 2018
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A new video of the Tenere 700
https://youtu.be/41fSt7C9jw4
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9 Jul 2018
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PatOnTrip
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Yam's new T7 just keeps looking better and better. Peterhansel has still got it.
Yamaha should hurry though, get this machine out there, get riders riding them. Based on my history and biased opinion ... if the two bikes are fairly equal ... I'd choose the Yamaha every time over KTM's forthcoming 790.
Cheaper to buy, run and maintain I'm betting more reliable long term.
And ... also would go for Yamaha as being the better RTW type travel bike.
Tougher, simpler, better. Better? Yes, the new Made In China KTM 790 will have to prove itself to me. For now, I'd pick the Made In Japan Yamaha.
For me, the T7 looks to be a GREAT compromise vs. my current Suzuki DR650. Sure, it's going to be heavier than my DR650 but it should be a better road bike and I'm betting it matches or betters the DR650 on fuel economy. (a real issue, IMO) How much heavier? No idea.
How will it perform loaded up with 20 + kg. luggage? Time will tell. I'll be waiting at least a year, giving time for both the T7 and 790 KTM to be properly vetted by experts and hopefully get some owner feedback too.
Last edited by mollydog; 10 Jul 2018 at 08:08.
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10 Jul 2018
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Location: Back into the hamster wheel again, in Oslo - Norway. Did a 5 year RTW trip/250 k kms, 2014-2019
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Are you you sure the new T7 Tenere or whatever they call it will be made in Japan? The last Tenere was never made in Japan. It started out in Italy but was eventually moved to Spain. My 2011 Tenere has a «Made in Spain» under the seat. (Maybe thats why its so infected with errors too maybe....?)
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Check the RAW segments; Grant, your HU host is on every month!
Episodes below to listen to while you, err, pretend to do something or other...
2020 Edition of Chris Scott's Adventure Motorcycling Handbook.
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Ripcord travel protection is now available for ALL nationalities, and travel is covered on motorcycles of all sizes!
What others say about HU...
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Lots more comments here!
Diaries of a compulsive traveller
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Back Road Map Books and Backroad GPS Maps for all of Canada - a must have!
New to Horizons Unlimited?
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Read more about Grant & Susan's story
Membership - help keep us going!
Horizons Unlimited is not a big multi-national company, just two people who love motorcycle travel and have grown what started as a hobby in 1997 into a full time job (usually 8-10 hours per day and 7 days a week) and a labour of love. To keep it going and a roof over our heads, we run events all over the world with the help of volunteers; we sell inspirational and informative DVDs; we have a few selected advertisers; and we make a small amount from memberships.
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helps answer the question - Why Go? Inspirational stories by veteran travellers Greg Frazier (5 times RTW), Peter and Kay Forwood (193 countries), Tiffany Coates (Mongolia Mayhem) and Rene Cormier (University of Gravel Roads).
Get Ready! covers planning, paperwork, medical and many other topics! "Inspirational and Awesome!" See the trailer here!
What stuff do I need - riding gear, clothing, camping gear, first aid kit, tires, maps and GPS? What don't I need? How do I pack it all in? Lots of opinions from over 150 travellers!
break down language barriers, overcome culture shock, ship the bike and deal with breakdowns and emergencies."Just makes me want to pack up and go!" See the trailer here!
Grant demystifies the black art of Tire Changing and Repair to help you STAY on the road! "Very informative and practical." See the trailer here!
Ladies on the Loose! For the first time ever, a motorcycle travel DVD made for women, by women! These intrepid women share their tips to help you plan your own motorcycle adventure. They also answer the women-only questions, and entertain you with amazing tales from the road! Presented by Lois Pryce, veteran solo traveller through South America and Africa and author of 'Lois on the Loose', and 'Red Tape and White Knuckles.'
Cotton or synth sweat-wicking t-shirts with the cool Horizons Unlimited graphic on the front and a snappy slogan (changing every year) on the back.
Show your route on your panniers. Great conversation starter when you meet people on the road!
Motorcycle and travel books to inspire and inform you!
The definitive guide to planning your motorcycle adventure! This insanely ambitious 2-year project has produced an informative and entertaining 5-part, 18 hour video series. "The ultimate round the world rider's how-to!" MCN UK.
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